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Parents’ shock as school takes thumb scans
A system which scans children's thumbprints to allow them to take out and return library books is at the centre of a row between parents and a school.
Mums and dads of children - aged between five and ten - at Long Lee Primary School claim they never gave their consent to their children's left thumbs being scanned. They have demanded any data obtained in this way is removed from the school's computer.
But head teacher Louise Smith has rejected arguments that the school has acted improperly.
She said the scanning technology, which is called Junior Librarian software, was fully covered by the school's IT rules, which all parents had signed up to. She said no images of thumbprints had been stored.
A concerned group of parents, most of whom did not want to be identified, first contacted the Keighley News at the end of last month.
One of the mums said she only found out about the thumb scans by accident.
She said: "A friend of mine asked me a couple of weeks ago, has your child had to have his fingerprints scanned?' and I said of course not - don't be silly'.Then my son said to me yes I have'.
"I asked him how this had happened and was told he used his left thumbprint to get books in and out of the school library."
She said she had no knowledge of signing a document that gave explicit permission for this practice.
"I don't want my son's print on any database," she added. "I'm annoyed that the school has gone ahead and done this and not asked my permission."
Two more mums, who also spoke to the Keighley News last week, said they had raised their concerns with Ofsted, the police and a councillor.
A father of two children at the school said he only learned of the fingerprint scanning on April 30. "I was gobsmacked," he said. "I'm not against things like ID cards but this is not the way to go."
However, Mrs Smith said: "All parents sign our school ICT rules giving permission to use the Internet, forums, e-mail and other ICT facilities at school, such as the automated library system. We use the software to track pupils' individual reading preferences.
"Pupils don't need to remember to bring anything, there is nothing that can be lost, stolen or exchanged. The system identifies the pupil's name and the item they are borrowing or returning.
"No print is stored. The software calculates a huge numerical value from a thumb scan, it is the number which is stored and it cannot be used to reconstruct the original image.
"It is, however, no problem to use a bar code rather than the scanner and we will now remind parents of this annually when they sign the ICT policy."
Oakbank School has used a thumb scanner in its library for five years. The Keighley News also contacted three other local secondary schools and six local primary schools - but none of these said that they used thumbprint scanners in their libraries.
Education Bradford said: "Junior Librarian is used in schools throughout the country and was recommended by the Department for Children, Schools and Families."
Publicity material from the manufacturers states: "No image of the fingerprint itself is ever stored and the unique number that is generated during registration can never be used to recreate an image of the original scan."
8:05am Thursday 8th May 2008
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CommentPosted by: lynne, Keighley on 1:32pm Thu 8 May 08
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
Posted by: ian, keighley on 2:49pm Thu 8 May 08
I am commenting on this article as Chair of Governors at Long Lee Primary School. You ask the question is the school right or are parents fears justified? This suggests a school in conflict with its parents. Nothing could be further from the truth. Your opening paragraph states the library system is "at the centre of a row between parents and school". The truth is no parent had even approached the school about this matter before speaking to the Keighley News. In your second paragraph you state "(the parents) have demanded any data obtained in this way is removed from the school's computer". Again the truth is that at this time of writing not a single such demand has been made to the school. Our school has a very good relationship with parents. It does your newspaper no credit to publish a story, sourced anonymously, which seems aimed at undermining that relationship. We welcome parents raising concerns and often find this helpful. It is a sign of an interested and involved body of parents. Implying conflict when there has been none is mischievous. Any concerns raised by parents of children at our school about the use of the library software in question will be addressed calmly, in the light of all the facts and information.
I am commenting on this article as Chair of Governors at Long Lee Primary School. You ask the question is the school right or are parents fears justified? This suggests a school in conflict with its parents. Nothing could be further from the truth. Your opening paragraph states the library system is "at the centre of a row between parents and school". The truth is no parent had even approached the school about this matter before speaking to the Keighley News. In your second paragraph you state "(the parents) have demanded any data obtained in this way is removed from the school's computer". Again the truth is that at this time of writing not a single such demand has been made to the school. Our school has a very good relationship with parents. It does your newspaper no credit to publish a story, sourced anonymously, which seems aimed at undermining that relationship. We welcome parents raising concerns and often find this helpful. It is a sign of an interested and involved body of parents. Implying conflict when there has been none is mischievous. Any concerns raised by parents of children at our school about the use of the library software in question will be addressed calmly, in the light of all the facts and information.
Posted by: fiona degler, keighley on 8:04pm Thu 8 May 08
To resond to Lynne, I am a parent of two boys at Long Lee Primary and am disgusted by your attitude to this issue! The school is exceptional and has top notch facilities and resources and provides an excellent education as you will well know.
Both Mrs Smith and the rest of the staff would never have hidden an issue as sensitive as this one and with hindsight yes maybe it should have been more clearly explained in the ICT agreement that we signed, but never the less the school has not endangered nor jeopardized our children in any way! I don't see why the annoymous parent's quoted in the article felt they needed to go straight to the Keighley News without taking their concerns to Mrs Smith. This would have been the correct way to deal with it, instead they have blown it out of all proportion and put a slur on an exceptional school (OFSTED will verify this!).
p.s the Department for Children, Schools and Families are formerly the DFES and have control over all schools and their policies so I would say that it's a pretty good bet that if they recommend it and hundreds of other primary and secondary schools use this software then it's more than likely to be 100% safe. Look them up and see for yourself then you might be better informed!
To resond to Lynne, I am a parent of two boys at Long Lee Primary and am disgusted by your attitude to this issue! The school is exceptional and has top notch facilities and resources and provides an excellent education as you will well know.
Both Mrs Smith and the rest of the staff would never have hidden an issue as sensitive as this one and with hindsight yes maybe it should have been more clearly explained in the ICT agreement that we signed, but never the less the school has not endangered nor jeopardized our children in any way! I don't see why the annoymous parent's quoted in the article felt they needed to go straight to the Keighley News without taking their concerns to Mrs Smith. This would have been the correct way to deal with it, instead they have blown it out of all proportion and put a slur on an exceptional school (OFSTED will verify this!).
p.s the Department for Children, Schools and Families are formerly the DFES and have control over all schools and their policies so I would say that it's a pretty good bet that if they recommend it and hundreds of other primary and secondary schools use this software then it's more than likely to be 100% safe. Look them up and see for yourself then you might be better informed!
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 10:17pm Thu 8 May 08
People having their prints scanned! Stories of outrage over possible storing of illegal data! Run to the hills Ma Barker, the police state is here and we are all doomed. Oh no, sorry, this isn't the case - it is simply a school using pupil thumbprints so that the same pupils can take out library books and such. Phew, thought that Interpol were introducing compulsory pupil registration there. Now excuse my flippancy and obvious sarcasm but, for one thing, I cannot understand the hoohaa that is surrounding this. I am a secondary school teacher [at a large 2100 pupil comp in Grimsby] and we use the same thumbscan technology to allow our students to access the resources of a well-stocked library. Now before someone points out "ah but you're in Grimsby, this is Keighley", myself and my partner have 2 children who attend Long Lee Primary [ages 7 and 9]. Both regurlary use the library and, surely in this day and age of falling Literacy rates, this is a **** good thing to encourage...well you'd think so, wouldn't you? Now correct me if I am wrong but isn't Long Lee Primary a godd school? Well, actually, no it isnt...it is an 'outstanding' school [as designated by OfSTED]. I have just been a part of a successful [outstanding] OfSTED inspection at my school and let me tell you a few things. 1. You don't get 'outstanding' from OfSTED by smiling nicely and offering them tea/coffe and biscuits. 2. You get rated as 'outstanding' by the hard work of teachers, leadership, Governers of the school who put into place systems that allow YOUR child to prgress better than those in similar educational situations. Instead of complaining about 'invasion of privacy', you should thank your lucky stars that YOUR child goes to a school that has 'outstanding' leadership, 'outstanding' facilities that go towards providing YOUR child with an 'outstanding' education. Instead of focussing on the negatives of this 'scandalous' registration system, why not look at the positives? Increased literacy, increased life chances, better educational standards and so on. Now before the liberals come out with the 'ah but I'm not against identity cards' arguments, let's be rational about this. It is simply a school library. It takes one piece of datum [your child's print] converts it into a digital signal and allows your child to access facilities that enhance and augment their learning and academic development. Why not write another letter complaing about Central Library's use of magnetic scan cards when YOUR child takes a book out in Keighley Town Centre - I mean that system contains more data than the school's system about your child! Long Lee Primary have stated that the system they use is strictly monitored and covered by their ICT policy. It is also covered by Government policy in the Data Protection Act (1998) which forbids and safeguards the wanton disclosure of personal data. Instead of moaning to the Press, you should have contacted the school and exercised your right to have your child's details [including thumbscan] removed from the school's system. Alas, this would also stop them using the facilities and thus not being able to take out books. Finally, instead of berating Long Lee Primary School and the head, Mrs. Smith, why not exercise another of your inalienable rights as a parent? Withdraw YOUR child from this 'obviously Facist school' and enter them into an alternative Primary School. But before you do so, there are not that many 'outstanding' Primary schools around so look carefully. Myself, and my partner, both heartily applaud the innovation that is allowing OUR children to thrive and prosper as learners whilst at Long Lee Primary...maybe you should adopt this attitude too. Long Lee Primary is an 'outstanding' school for a reason.
People having their prints scanned! Stories of outrage over possible storing of illegal data! Run to the hills Ma Barker, the police state is here and we are all doomed. Oh no, sorry, this isn't the case - it is simply a school using pupil thumbprints so that the same pupils can take out library books and such. Phew, thought that Interpol were introducing compulsory pupil registration there. Now excuse my flippancy and obvious sarcasm but, for one thing, I cannot understand the hoohaa that is surrounding this. I am a secondary school teacher and we use the same thumbscan technology to allow our students to access the resources of a well-stocked library. Now before someone points out "ah but you're in Grimsby, this is Keighley", myself and my partner have 2 children who attend Long Lee Primary . Both regurlary use the library and, surely in this day and age of falling Literacy rates, this is a **** good thing to encourage...well you'd think so, wouldn't you? Now correct me if I am wrong but isn't Long Lee Primary a godd school? Well, actually, no it isnt...it is an 'outstanding' school . I have just been a part of a successful OfSTED inspection at my school and let me tell you a few things. 1. You don't get 'outstanding' from OfSTED by smiling nicely and offering them tea/coffe and biscuits. 2. You get rated as 'outstanding' by the hard work of teachers, leadership, Governers of the school who put into place systems that allow YOUR child to prgress better than those in similar educational situations. Instead of complaining about 'invasion of privacy', you should thank your lucky stars that YOUR child goes to a school that has 'outstanding' leadership, 'outstanding' facilities that go towards providing YOUR child with an 'outstanding' education. Instead of focussing on the negatives of this 'scandalous' registration system, why not look at the positives? Increased literacy, increased life chances, better educational standards and so on. Now before the liberals come out with the 'ah but I'm not against identity cards' arguments, let's be rational about this. It is simply a school library. It takes one piece of datum converts it into a digital signal and allows your child to access facilities that enhance and augment their learning and academic development. Why not write another letter complaing about Central Library's use of magnetic scan cards when YOUR child takes a book out in Keighley Town Centre - I mean that system contains more data than the school's system about your child! Long Lee Primary have stated that the system they use is strictly monitored and covered by their ICT policy. It is also covered by Government policy in the Data Protection Act (1998) which forbids and safeguards the wanton disclosure of personal data. Instead of moaning to the Press, you should have contacted the school and exercised your right to have your child's details removed from the school's system. Alas, this would also stop them using the facilities and thus not being able to take out books. Finally, instead of berating Long Lee Primary School and the head, Mrs. Smith, why not exercise another of your inalienable rights as a parent? Withdraw YOUR child from this 'obviously Facist school' and enter them into an alternative Primary School. But before you do so, there are not that many 'outstanding' Primary schools around so look carefully. Myself, and my partner, both heartily applaud the innovation that is allowing OUR children to thrive and prosper as learners whilst at Long Lee Primary...maybe you should adopt this attitude too. Long Lee Primary is an 'outstanding' school for a reason.
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 10:21pm Thu 8 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 10:23pm Thu 8 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 10:24pm Thu 8 May 08
People having their prints scanned! Stories of outrage over possible storing of illegal data! Run to the hills Ma Barker, the police state is here and we are all doomed. Oh no, sorry, this isn't the case - it is simply a school using pupil thumbprints so that the same pupils can take out library books and such. Phew, thought that Interpol were introducing compulsory pupil registration there. Now excuse my flippancy and obvious sarcasm but, for one thing, I cannot understand the hoohaa that is surrounding this. I am a secondary school teacher [at a large 2100 pupil comp in Grimsby] and we use the same thumbscan technology to allow our students to access the resources of a well-stocked library. Now before someone points out "ah but you're in Grimsby, this is Keighley", myself and my partner have 2 children who attend Long Lee Primary [ages 7 and 9]. Both regurlary use the library and, surely in this day and age of falling Literacy rates, this is a **** good thing to encourage...well you'd think so, wouldn't you? Now correct me if I am wrong but isn't Long Lee Primary a godd school? Well, actually, no it isnt...it is an 'outstanding' school [as designated by OfSTED]. I have just been a part of a successful [outstanding] OfSTED inspection at my school and let me tell you a few things. 1. You don't get 'outstanding' from OfSTED by smiling nicely and offering them tea/coffe and biscuits. 2. You get rated as 'outstanding' by the hard work of teachers, leadership, Governers of the school who put into place systems that allow YOUR child to prgress better than those in similar educational situations. Instead of complaining about 'invasion of privacy', you should thank your lucky stars that YOUR child goes to a school that has 'outstanding' leadership, 'outstanding' facilities that go towards providing YOUR child with an 'outstanding' education. Instead of focussing on the negatives of this 'scandalous' registration system, why not look at the positives? Increased literacy, increased life chances, better educational standards and so on. Now before the liberals come out with the 'ah but I'm not against identity cards' arguments, let's be rational about this. It is simply a school library. It takes one piece of datum [your child's print] converts it into a digital signal and allows your child to access facilities that enhance and augment their learning and academic development. Why not write another letter complaing about Central Library's use of magnetic scan cards when YOUR child takes a book out in Keighley Town Centre - I mean that system contains more data than the school's system about your child! Long Lee Primary have stated that the system they use is strictly monitored and covered by their ICT policy. It is also covered by Government policy in the Data Protection Act (1998) which forbids and safeguards the wanton disclosure of personal data. Instead of moaning to the Press, you should have contacted the school and exercised your right to have your child's details [including thumbscan] removed from the school's system. Alas, this would also stop them using the facilities and thus not being able to take out books. Finally, instead of berating Long Lee Primary School and the head, Mrs. Smith, why not exercise another of your inalienable rights as a parent? Withdraw YOUR child from this 'obviously Facist school' and enter them into an alternative Primary School. But before you do so, there are not that many 'outstanding' Primary schools around so look carefully. Myself, and my partner, both heartily applaud the innovation that is allowing OUR children to thrive and prosper as learners whilst at Long Lee Primary...maybe you should adopt this attitude too. Long Lee Primary is an 'outstanding' school for a reason.
People having their prints scanned! Stories of outrage over possible storing of illegal data! Run to the hills Ma Barker, the police state is here and we are all doomed. Oh no, sorry, this isn't the case - it is simply a school using pupil thumbprints so that the same pupils can take out library books and such. Phew, thought that Interpol were introducing compulsory pupil registration there. Now excuse my flippancy and obvious sarcasm but, for one thing, I cannot understand the hoohaa that is surrounding this. I am a secondary school teacher and we use the same thumbscan technology to allow our students to access the resources of a well-stocked library. Now before someone points out "ah but you're in Grimsby, this is Keighley", myself and my partner have 2 children who attend Long Lee Primary . Both regurlary use the library and, surely in this day and age of falling Literacy rates, this is a **** good thing to encourage...well you'd think so, wouldn't you? Now correct me if I am wrong but isn't Long Lee Primary a godd school? Well, actually, no it isnt...it is an 'outstanding' school . I have just been a part of a successful OfSTED inspection at my school and let me tell you a few things. 1. You don't get 'outstanding' from OfSTED by smiling nicely and offering them tea/coffe and biscuits. 2. You get rated as 'outstanding' by the hard work of teachers, leadership, Governers of the school who put into place systems that allow YOUR child to prgress better than those in similar educational situations. Instead of complaining about 'invasion of privacy', you should thank your lucky stars that YOUR child goes to a school that has 'outstanding' leadership, 'outstanding' facilities that go towards providing YOUR child with an 'outstanding' education. Instead of focussing on the negatives of this 'scandalous' registration system, why not look at the positives? Increased literacy, increased life chances, better educational standards and so on. Now before the liberals come out with the 'ah but I'm not against identity cards' arguments, let's be rational about this. It is simply a school library. It takes one piece of datum converts it into a digital signal and allows your child to access facilities that enhance and augment their learning and academic development. Why not write another letter complaing about Central Library's use of magnetic scan cards when YOUR child takes a book out in Keighley Town Centre - I mean that system contains more data than the school's system about your child! Long Lee Primary have stated that the system they use is strictly monitored and covered by their ICT policy. It is also covered by Government policy in the Data Protection Act (1998) which forbids and safeguards the wanton disclosure of personal data. Instead of moaning to the Press, you should have contacted the school and exercised your right to have your child's details removed from the school's system. Alas, this would also stop them using the facilities and thus not being able to take out books. Finally, instead of berating Long Lee Primary School and the head, Mrs. Smith, why not exercise another of your inalienable rights as a parent? Withdraw YOUR child from this 'obviously Facist school' and enter them into an alternative Primary School. But before you do so, there are not that many 'outstanding' Primary schools around so look carefully. Myself, and my partner, both heartily applaud the innovation that is allowing OUR children to thrive and prosper as learners whilst at Long Lee Primary...maybe you should adopt this attitude too. Long Lee Primary is an 'outstanding' school for a reason.
Posted by: adeythom, Silsden on 7:55am Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]smeaton[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote: I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.[/quote] proffread?
smeaton wrote:
lynne wrote: I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
proffread?
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 9:31am Fri 9 May 08
Adeythom,
it was my attempt at sarcasm, hence the simple mis-spelling of 'proofread'
G.
Adeythom,
it was my attempt at sarcasm, hence the simple mis-spelling of 'proofread'
G.
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 9:32am Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!!
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!!
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 9:33am Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]smeaton[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.[/quote] You mean proof-read!
smeaton wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
You mean proof-read!
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 9:34am Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]Mark[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!![/quote] And I meant advice!
Mark wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!!
And I meant advice!
Posted by: lynne, Keighley on 12:40pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]Mark[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!![/quote] Why dont you try going on www.leavethemkidsalo
ne.com it may help you to take your blinkers off.
Mark wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!!
Why dont you try going on www.leavethemkidsalo
ne.com it may help you to take your blinkers off.
Posted by: lynne, Keighley on 12:45pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]Mark[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]smeaton[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.[/quote] You mean proof-read![/quote] As a teacher you must know that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. And when the words finger print at a local school is a headline, parents are inclined to panic.
Mark wrote:
smeaton wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
You mean proof-read!
As a teacher you must know that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. And when the words finger print at a local school is a headline, parents are inclined to panic.
Posted by: lynne, Keighley on 1:01pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]ian[/bold] wrote:
I am commenting on this article as Chair of Governors at Long Lee Primary School. You ask the question is the school right or are parents fears justified? This suggests a school in conflict with its parents. Nothing could be further from the truth. Your opening paragraph states the library system is "at the centre of a row between parents and school". The truth is no parent had even approached the school about this matter before speaking to the Keighley News. In your second paragraph you state "(the parents) have demanded any data obtained in this way is removed from the school's computer". Again the truth is that at this time of writing not a single such demand has been made to the school. Our school has a very good relationship with parents. It does your newspaper no credit to publish a story, sourced anonymously, which seems aimed at undermining that relationship. We welcome parents raising concerns and often find this helpful. It is a sign of an interested and involved body of parents. Implying conflict when there has been none is mischievous. Any concerns raised by parents of children at our school about the use of the library software in question will be addressed calmly, in the light of all the facts and information.[/quote] A few feathers ruffled me thinks.
ian wrote:
I am commenting on this article as Chair of Governors at Long Lee Primary School. You ask the question is the school right or are parents fears justified? This suggests a school in conflict with its parents. Nothing could be further from the truth. Your opening paragraph states the library system is "at the centre of a row between parents and school". The truth is no parent had even approached the school about this matter before speaking to the Keighley News. In your second paragraph you state "(the parents) have demanded any data obtained in this way is removed from the school's computer". Again the truth is that at this time of writing not a single such demand has been made to the school. Our school has a very good relationship with parents. It does your newspaper no credit to publish a story, sourced anonymously, which seems aimed at undermining that relationship. We welcome parents raising concerns and often find this helpful. It is a sign of an interested and involved body of parents. Implying conflict when there has been none is mischievous. Any concerns raised by parents of children at our school about the use of the library software in question will be addressed calmly, in the light of all the facts and information.
A few feathers ruffled me thinks.
Posted by: smeaton, Keighley on 1:23pm Fri 9 May 08
to Mark from Haworth; there are two different [yet perfectly acceptable ways] to spell the word: with hypen is the 'accepted Americanised spelling'; without hypen [therefore as a single word] is the accepted Anglicised spelling].
But pedantics aside, the serious issue is that someone has complained about an issue whereby children are having their thumbs scanned without first directing their criticism at the school. Running to the Press complaining only denigrates the 'outstanding' features that Long Lee Primary has worked so hard to create. Parents have a choice; should they not like the way that the school operates a site-wide policy then simply remove the child to a school that doesn't operate such an openly 'oppressive' regime. As for the anonimity - if you are going to scream 'infringements and invasions of privacy' to the Press then at least give your names. What's the worst that could happen? Loads of angry children descending to your abode waving mucky thumbprints. Ah well, we live in a 'complaint culture' what can we expect. Let Long Lee Primary get on with what it does best - TEACHING - rather than have the eyes of a blinkered few directed at them.
to Mark from Haworth; there are two different to spell the word: with hypen is the 'accepted Americanised spelling'; without hypen is the accepted Anglicised spelling].
But pedantics aside, the serious issue is that someone has complained about an issue whereby children are having their thumbs scanned without first directing their criticism at the school. Running to the Press complaining only denigrates the 'outstanding' features that Long Lee Primary has worked so hard to create. Parents have a choice; should they not like the way that the school operates a site-wide policy then simply remove the child to a school that doesn't operate such an openly 'oppressive' regime. As for the anonimity - if you are going to scream 'infringements and invasions of privacy' to the Press then at least give your names. What's the worst that could happen? Loads of angry children descending to your abode waving mucky thumbprints. Ah well, we live in a 'complaint culture' what can we expect. Let Long Lee Primary get on with what it does best - TEACHING - rather than have the eyes of a blinkered few directed at them.
Posted by: lynne, Keighley on 2:08pm Fri 9 May 08
The School as a whole is not the issue here. Its the fact that alarm bells have rung and the problem needs to be addressed. Get off your high horses and help with solving the issue and stop with the cocky attitude.
The School as a whole is not the issue here. Its the fact that alarm bells have rung and the problem needs to be addressed. Get off your high horses and help with solving the issue and stop with the cocky attitude.
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 2:21pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Mark[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!![/quote] Why dont you try going on www.leavethemkidsalo
ne.com it may help you to take your blinkers off.[/quote] I directed you to the website of a government department you said you didn't know of.
I assume by the lack of thanks that you weren't really interested in this organisation relating to the education of children.
Thanks but no thanks for the reciprocal link.
lynne wrote:
Mark wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
Lynne
A simple search on google would have helped you avoid making a naive statement - "And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them."
Visit http://www.dfes.gov.
uk/
A word of advise - do your homework before shouting in public!!
Why dont you try going on www.leavethemkidsalo
ne.com it may help you to take your blinkers off.
I directed you to the website of a government department you said you didn't know of.
I assume by the lack of thanks that you weren't really interested in this organisation relating to the education of children.
Thanks but no thanks for the reciprocal link.
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 2:33pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
The School as a whole is not the issue here. Its the fact that alarm bells have rung and the problem needs to be addressed. Get off your high horses and help with solving the issue and stop with the cocky attitude. [/quote] Whether it be a high horse or a soap box I would have more concern regarding plastic in peoples wallets/purses.
The school and software manufacturers state that no personal information is retained.
Parents do allow their child to have a Council run library card on which the system stores DOB and addresses.
People need to pause and think things through before shouting their mouths off.
lynne wrote:
The School as a whole is not the issue here. Its the fact that alarm bells have rung and the problem needs to be addressed. Get off your high horses and help with solving the issue and stop with the cocky attitude.
Whether it be a high horse or a soap box I would have more concern regarding plastic in peoples wallets/purses.
The school and software manufacturers state that no personal information is retained.
Parents do allow their child to have a Council run library card on which the system stores DOB and addresses.
People need to pause and think things through before shouting their mouths off.
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 2:34pm Fri 9 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Mark[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]smeaton[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.[/quote] No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.[/quote] You mean proof-read![/quote] As a teacher you must know that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. And when the words finger print at a local school is a headline, parents are inclined to panic.[/quote] I'm not a teacher!
lynne wrote:
Mark wrote:
smeaton wrote:
lynne wrote:
I feel that the school has totally misled parents. To cover the finger print ID under ICT facilities is not acceptable. Is too sensetive an issue to be included in the IT policy. When I approached the Headteacher she couldnt show me any evidence of us signing any agreement. If it said on the agreement about finger printing being used, I doubt that I would of signed it.And what is the Department for Children, schools and families. Never heard of them. Also I feel that the head teacher has had too longer time to come up with an excuse to cover her and the school.
No disrespect but maybe you should have got your child to proffread this before you submitted it to this forum.
You mean proof-read!
As a teacher you must know that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit. And when the words finger print at a local school is a headline, parents are inclined to panic.
I'm not a teacher!
Posted by: lynne, Keighley on 2:45pm Fri 9 May 08
Its getting a bit too personal and a bit bitchy. Best we leave it there and agree too disagree. As for the website i did look at it. Whether or not you looked at the one I gave you....its up to you. Lets hope and I think you may all agree that the issue be promptly addressed. And then we can all get on with our little lives in our perfect little world.
Its getting a bit too personal and a bit bitchy. Best we leave it there and agree too disagree. As for the website i did look at it. Whether or not you looked at the one I gave you....its up to you. Lets hope and I think you may all agree that the issue be promptly addressed. And then we can all get on with our little lives in our perfect little world.
Posted by: Mark, Haworth on 2:27pm Sun 11 May 08
[quote][bold]lynne[/bold] wrote:
Its getting a bit too personal and a bit bitchy. Best we leave it there and agree too disagree. As for the website i did look at it. Whether or not you looked at the one I gave you....its up to you. Lets hope and I think you may all agree that the issue be promptly addressed. And then we can all get on with our little lives in our perfect little world.[/quote] Mine ain't perfect by any means.
lynne wrote:
Its getting a bit too personal and a bit bitchy. Best we leave it there and agree too disagree. As for the website i did look at it. Whether or not you looked at the one I gave you....its up to you. Lets hope and I think you may all agree that the issue be promptly addressed. And then we can all get on with our little lives in our perfect little world.
Mine ain't perfect by any means.
Posted by: anon bingley, Bradford on 5:50pm Sun 11 May 08
Its a while since I can say that I have been incensed by an article but this really got the blood flowing!
Shame on you Keighley News for printing the anon hearsay and factually incorrect nonsense from a small cluster of parents with nothing better to do.
3 official sources all say that the Junior Librarian System is perfectly safe.
If anybody reading this gets five minutes put Long Lee Primary School into the search tool bar. Feb 8th an article proclaiming the school as 'outstanding'.
Take a moment to think just how the teachers at Long Lee must feel right now as a result of this article. Why anyone would chose to be a teacher these days is beyond me.
An act of pure cowardess and salacious embellishment of the truth.
Congratulations to the parents, a real example to be setting your children.
I'm sure as you are so disgusted with the school you will be moving your children out immediately.
And to the head Mrs Smith and the staff at Long Lee, beleive me when I say there are many parents out here who do appreciate the work that has gone into making Long Lee one of the best Primary schools in the district.
Its a while since I can say that I have been incensed by an article but this really got the blood flowing!
Shame on you Keighley News for printing the anon hearsay and factually incorrect nonsense from a small cluster of parents with nothing better to do.
3 official sources all say that the Junior Librarian System is perfectly safe.
If anybody reading this gets five minutes put Long Lee Primary School into the search tool bar. Feb 8th an article proclaiming the school as 'outstanding'.
Take a moment to think just how the teachers at Long Lee must feel right now as a result of this article. Why anyone would chose to be a teacher these days is beyond me.
An act of pure cowardess and salacious embellishment of the truth.
Congratulations to the parents, a real example to be setting your children.
I'm sure as you are so disgusted with the school you will be moving your children out immediately.
And to the head Mrs Smith and the staff at Long Lee, beleive me when I say there are many parents out here who do appreciate the work that has gone into making Long Lee one of the best Primary schools in the district.
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